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Blue Grit Podcast: The Voice of Texas Law Enforcement
2024: Ranked #1 Law Podcast
Host: Tyler Owen and Clint McNear discussing topics, issues, and stories within the law enforcement community. TMPA is the voice of Texas Law Enforcement, focused on protecting those who serve. Since 1950, we have been defending the rights and interests of Texas Peace Officers by providing the best legal assistance in the country, effective lobbying at state and local levels, affordable training, and exemplary member support. As the largest law enforcement association in Texas, TMPA is proud to represent 33,000 local, county and state law enforcement officers.
Blue Grit Podcast: The Voice of Texas Law Enforcement
#119- "The Impact of 8%" with TMRS Marin Emma & Shannon Lucero
For the second time, the Texas Municipal Retirement System (TMRS) joins the Blue Grit Podcast to talk about what could be a historic shift for public safety retirement in Texas.
Guests Marin Emma and Shannon Lucero from TMRS break down a new bill that, if passed, would raise both the employee contribution and the city match to 8%. The conversation dives into how this proposed change would impact officers across the state, what it means for long-term retirement security, and why it matters to start planning today.
This episode gives listeners a clear, straightforward look at what’s on the horizon for TMRS members — and how the decisions made in Austin could shape the future for officers and their families.
email us at- bluegrit@tmpa.org
okay, we'll wait, hello, fix that what are you trying to fix? Okay, I just, I saw my hair went.
Speaker 3:I see your earrings look good that's that's brighter. Yeah, we had some guys on that do a lot of stuff with netflix and, um man, they they were pretty critical of our lighting. I'm gonna echo all right, that's my professional clapper. All right, that's my professional clapper. So when you're talking, if you can scoot up for me and then, almost like touch your lips.
Speaker 2:Like this, yep.
Speaker 1:Okay, if you could scoot up a little more on the table, get close.
Speaker 3:I mean this, like the microphone kind of tickles my beard Okay, like that's even how close it goes.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but I want to be able to see your face, yeah, okay, there we go.
Speaker 3:And they're perfect. Okay, all right, all right, so I'm just going to talk about I'll get some updates on TMPA and then talk about the last time.
Speaker 1:You guys have been on Some updates have happened blah blah blah and we'll just kind of wing it. Do you remember what month we did it? In 23? Because we didn't talk about the COLA bill in 23, the non-retro. Do we want to go there?
Speaker 2:Probably not.
Speaker 1:Not Okay, okay. So things that have changed. New executive director.
Speaker 2:Yep.
Speaker 1:New my Team Restory design and 8% bill and we can talk about why the my Team Restory design is so cool. Yep and beneficiary designations proportionate those three topics. Okay, that's good.
Speaker 3:I'm looking back at what episode it was, so I can reference the episode number. There was 23. And that was two years ago 23. She almost walked away with nothing. It was the episode. That's what we called it.
Speaker 1:Right. She almost gave up $680,000. She almost walked away from $680,000.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that's it.
Speaker 2:She was a cop.
Speaker 3:Oh my goodness do you want to dive off into the members that transition from county to state to city and how that we touched on a little bit last time too, I think, yeah, I think it's called.
Speaker 1:I don't think we ever really said what it was called, but I remember clint making a, a big deal at the beginning that even if your county or state listen to this podcast, um, but we never actually said proportionate retirement that's what it's called, yeah, so and how it works with tmrs
Speaker 3:cool, cool, y'all ready? I don, I got an echo Weird.
Speaker 1:Are you leaving the door open? Yeah, this time Okay.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's just me running the camera.
Speaker 1:Oh, okay.
Speaker 3:We've gotten high tech.
Speaker 1:You have gotten high tech for two years. Last time we netted this in there. All right, here we go.
Speaker 3:Here we go.
Speaker 1:All right, let's go. Here we go, all right let's go.
Speaker 3:Welcome back. Viewers, watchers, listeners. I'm your host, tyler Owen. Hope you guys are staying safe and being cool as summer is coming to a close. And again I said this last episode thank God our kids are back in school. Thank goodness they drove me crazy this summer, and so to have those young kiddos back in the educational aspect of things and out of my hair, it's a pleasure. But football season's going on. High school football and NFL has kicked off as we're recording this podcast, super excited about that. It is my favorite time of the year fall. With that being said, we just had our conference last month and we got to run into some old friends. Yes, we did, and so we're going to have back on TMRS. Last episode was episode 23. She almost walked away with $680,000. It was an early episode on Blue Grit and so we wanted to have him back on Shannon with TMRS.
Speaker 1:Welcome back hi, tyler, thank you, I agree.
Speaker 3:I walked out this morning and I was like oh, 75 degrees oh my god, it was 58 in wimbley, 58, yeah, it did it felt amazing.
Speaker 1:I loved it and thank you. I was so glad when you asked me back at the conference and hey, we want to bring you back. I'm like, is he ever actually gonna call?
Speaker 3:oh, yeah, I did. I did, you know, and we got a lot of calls and texts about really, the information that was pushed out there, and so it's a lot of good, useful information. In fact, we referenced you guys. We had a financial cop on Nick Daughtry, a former police officer with Grand Prairie. You guys worked closely with him and some other financial institutions such as the McLean Advisors. We referenced that TMRS episode multiple times in a lot of our episodes and it's now the importance of understanding the financial difficulties and challenges that cops really don't do a lot of research on. I mean, let's just call it what it is and so you guys are a huge benefit, a huge asset when it comes to those big times to punch that ticket and retire.
Speaker 3:So I'm not sure if you've ever and I'm sorry I didn't introduce you, I'm Marion Emma with TMRS, and so last time we had Debbie Munoz, who has moved on To bigger things. Congratulations to Debbie. Oh yeah, moved, yeah, well, moved up. I should say Not moved on, moved up, moved up, yeah. So Debbie's also A Wimberlite. She lives there In Wimberley. In super excited to have her at the executive director spot with tmrs yeah, she took the helm july.
Speaker 1:Uh, first she took the helm and we are so thrilled. Yeah, yeah, she's just awesome.
Speaker 3:She's bubbly, her personality brings it. She seems like a good leader and it seems like she's, you know, willing to step in there and do whatever she can to, uh, make the mission successful. So she.
Speaker 1:She grew up in tmrs. She's at 27 years now. She has skin in the game. She cares about Team Rest. It's not just a notch on her belt, she's diehard.
Speaker 2:We love it, agreed, I mean. She has the true heart of a public servant. Everything she does, every decision she makes is for the benefit of our members and for our cities, and I'm just so excited to see where Team Rest is going to go under her leadership.
Speaker 3:Well, and what's so interesting is that, for those that don't know, Debbie, her husband is a retired Austin police officer, a super nice guy, and so when you say she has skin in the game, she legitimately does have skin in the game with a spouse you know in public safety and a TMRS recipient I guess is the best way to say it or contributor for many years, with him being with Austin police department. Uh, and so, yeah, she has skin in the game.
Speaker 1:She does. We love her, we love her. She was has been my mentor since I started and I looked back at our last podcast in 23 and I was like, yeah, I've been with Team Rest for 21 years and now I've been with Team Rest for 23 years.
Speaker 3:It's been two years.
Speaker 1:I thought it had only been a year and I was like oh wow, and even for reference that first podcast, I remember Clint saying oh, you guys have 928 cities in the system. We are now at 944.
Speaker 3:Wow, wow. Texas is growing for sure. Texas is growing for sure. Well, there's been some big updates with this last legislative session, the 88th, just closed. We're in special session now, but nothing significant in regards to TMRS, and that's why we want to have you guys on to talk about how does this impact our members, our viewers, our watchers, and how does this 8% ordeal kind of impact them. So we want to have you guys on and discuss that.
Speaker 2:And do you want to go? Yeah, absolutely so. As some of you guys probably have heard, in this last session there was a bill that passed that adds an 8% employee contribution option to TMRS and just took effect on September the 1st, so it is brand new Some misconceptions that I think Shannon and I have heard out on the road. At the individual level. Someone can't elect an 8% contribution to TMRS. It's going to be a city decision. Just like in the past, cities could opt for 5%, 6% or 7%. The 8% is just another option that cities can choose to enhance their benefit for their workforce.
Speaker 3:So what you're saying is that if Plano, the city of Plano, right now contributes, do y'all know how?
Speaker 2:many Seven.
Speaker 3:Okay, and so if they want to be more desirable place to work for all city employees, they can opt in to the 8% Break that down for the viewer. That's not really up to speed on the retirement for the 22-year-old cop out there that's listening to this podcast. What does that mean for the 8% and how it affects them later on in life?
Speaker 1:Well, team Rest is a cash balance plan, so the more money you put in, the higher your benefit's going to be. That's what it really boils down to. We're calculating the benefit on how much money is in your account. Plano, that example, is a 7% two-to-one city, which means every employee of TMRS, of Plano that's in TMRS contributes 7% of their gross pay every month. That money sorry, that money grows at 5% interest and then at retirement, once they've met that eligibility and they can retire, plano is going to double that account balance. So if you go from paying 7% to 8%, you're putting more money in, you're earning more interest, you're earning more cities match. So it means an increased benefit down the road. But if we really go and talk about that, we're also talking about that updated service credits and we kind of touched on that last time. Updated service credits is this other provision in TMRS which I looked at the statistic yesterday Almost 70% I'm sorry, 90% of our population, our membership in TMRS is covered with an updated service credit.
Speaker 3:Okay.
Speaker 1:So this 8% is not just about 1% extra going into the TMRS account each month, because a lot of officers that I've talked to and members, it's only 1%. Why does it cost the city so much money if we go 8%? It's because of this other feature of TeamRest that they have so Plano. They have updated service credits, which means for a lack of a better word it almost. This calculation goes in and almost acts as if that employee had been contributing 8% their whole career.
Speaker 3:So it's not necessarily retroactive.
Speaker 1:It's not dollar for dollar, it's like what I explain. It's apples to apples but it's a red apple to a green apple. It's not exact, because the nature of the updated service credit calculation grows at 3% where our real dollars grow at 5%. So when we're running this updated service credit calculation, it's just a financial credit that can be added to the account based on the city's current plan.
Speaker 3:Got you.
Speaker 1:And so when a city goes 8%, it's not just that that member is now contributing 8% of their salary. If that city has that optional updated service credit, it means that following January, when we're running that calculation, we're assuming, to run this calculation, that they had always been 8%, and so that member receives a huge financial credit that the city funds 100% and can skyrocket their benefit. So that's where those hidden costs of going 8% are.
Speaker 3:So if you have a 28-year officer that's fixing to possibly punch out, let's just say again Plano, cause you guys know the numbers. There's such a large city, is this how, how? How does this 1% impact them? If they've been there 27 years? Is the? Is the 1% going to significantly add to their benefit retirement package? If Plano opts into the 8%?
Speaker 2:Absolutely.
Speaker 3:Okay, even if they punch out next year at the end of it, they're going to contribute back on the back end on that 1%.
Speaker 1:Absolutely so. What happens is in January let's say Plano, for example does this 8% bill and they add in 8% as of November, right, Because it only became effective in September? And, by the way, we do have one city. We already have a city that has adopted and sent us the ordinance.
Speaker 3:Can we tell that who it is?
Speaker 1:It's the city of Crandall.
Speaker 3:Okay.
Speaker 1:Crandall Texas.
Speaker 3:There you go.
Speaker 1:So they have already sent us their ordinance. But let's say Plano does it. Let's say, hey, plano is going to do it. They get their budget passed. They send us the model ordinance or the ordinance for 8% in November. That means in January, when we run that updated service credit calculation. Every employee there, that 27-year cop, that 10-year employee, when we're running that updated service credit calculation, we're going in and pulling in their average salary, assuming they'd been making this average salary their entire 27 year career, not contributing at 7%, but now having contributed at 8%.
Speaker 3:Okay.
Speaker 1:And we compare this real versus hypothetical. So we look at this hypothetical account and we'll look at the real numbers and if this hypothetical is higher than real, they actually get the difference added to their account and a financial credit. And being that Teamers, is a cash balance plan. Okay, the higher the cash, the higher the balance. So you have, well, we have four accounts of money, right, you have the money that came in out of your paychecks, interest earned on it. Cities match, and then if your city has this optional updated service credit provision, you have that. So you have these four sources of money that create an account balance. And then on the other side, you have their age, right. So we take these and to determine the benefit. So if the cash balance skyrockets, that means their monthly benefit skyrockets.
Speaker 3:Talk real quick again for the 20 to 25, 30 year old cop out there or city employee that happens to be tuned into this podcast. Talk about what the difference in a cash balance plan is and if you can kind of dive off into what that truly means.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So the way we calculate our benefit in a cash balance plan. It is a little different than some of the other retirement systems some of your listeners may be familiar with, and I'll use ERS as an example because that's where I came from. So ERS, trs, their calculation is very formula driven. You can put a pen to paper, you can do the math right. They say for every one year of service you get X percent of your final average salary in retirement.
Speaker 2:Tmrs, again, as Shannon said, is a cash balance plan. There's essentially two sides to the equation we're going to look at. One side is the financial side of things. How much have you accumulated in all of your different buckets of money from day one? You know, between the contributions from your paycheck, the interest, the match from your city and any updated service credits that you've been awarded. The other side of the equation looks at your age at retirement and, by extension, your life expectancy in retirement, and then we're going to annuitize or spread out the available funding over that anticipated payout period in retirement.
Speaker 2:So what I always tell people is the more buckets of money that you have and the fuller that they are, the larger your final ending balance is, the greater your monthly benefit in retirement is going to be. To kind of give an example of impact of that updated service credit, let's say we have someone whose city does not provide updated service credit and at retirement, between their contributions and interest and match, they have $100,000 in their TMRS reserve. We're going to spread that out over their life expectancy. But if they did have updated service credit and maybe they had an additional $50,000 that they've been awarded, now they have $150,000 in their reserve. That's being spread out over that same life expectancy. So the more money you have being spread out throughout your lifetime, the greater that monthly benefit in retirement is going to be for you.
Speaker 3:Got you, got you. That makes a little more sense.
Speaker 1:And I think for the younger employees, like you were pointing out, Tyler is power of retirement account is time right, those young officers who start, who stay in the system and continue to grow their account, they're going to have a higher benefit and they're going to literally be able to see that, hey, maybe I can retire at 50, at 55 because they stayed in. And I know when I'm in the field, go out in the field. Right, I tell you, I have stories over story over story of story. Go in the field and you're talking to these young guys and they're like, uh, it's retirement, it's so far away, it's not that big of a deal.
Speaker 1:And I, three weeks ago, was covering a fair and a gentleman came up to me, whole group of people, and he's like hey, I have a question, so what? And he goes, I'm thinking of leaving the department. I have four and a half years and it was a five-year vesting study. And I was like, okay, because what are my options? I was like, oh, come on, man One, stay the extra six months, get that vesting status. And we talked about vesting in the last one, that that just vesting puts you on a pathway to a pension. You have locked it in. You're now on a path to a pension and I'm like get that. And I said but if you are going to leave, you can. Are you going to go to another department? He says, well, I haven't made up my mind yet. I said well, here are your options.
Speaker 1:If you leave, before hitting that bested status, you have a five-year window to just leave it alone. Nothing says you have to make a decision with your TMRS money right away. Leave it alone. And he goes. But I'm never going to get their match. And I go hold on. If in that five-year window, you come back into TMRS, we connect the accounts. You're now you're going to get that.
Speaker 1:And he looked at me and he goes, but I'm not going to get this city's match. And I said whoa, hold on. There's two pathways and I'm and I'm explaining I go if you come back into TMRS and we connect your accounts, or you hit that vested status and you reach retirement eligibility of any sort. So he was at city A.
Speaker 1:If he goes to city B and ends up finishing out his time and he retires in his head, I will never get this city's money because I didn't do the five years at the city and I'm like no, no, no, no. Vesting is system wide, not city specific. You just need to get vested. And he's looking at me like I am crazy and I am doing everything I can to explain this. I'm like you have two pathways. I'm every possible way to explain to him If you get vested, you will get the city's money. But he had been told over and over and over that he had to be in that city for five years to get the city's money, which is not true, right, and you just have to be in the system.
Speaker 2:I hear that all the time as well. People think they have to vest at each individual city, and what I always tell people is if you reach the point where you are eligible for a retirement benefit with TMRS, no matter how you reach that point, that retirement benefit will be funded by not only the contributions you've made but also the matching dollars from all of the cities that you are with. So, whether you're eligible for a benefit because you did 20 years all with one city, or whether you're eligible because you did 10 years with this city or 10 years with that city, whether you're eligible because you did one year at five different cities and now you're 60 years old, if you are eligible for a retirement benefit with us, you are going to get those matching dollars from all of the cities that you were with throughout your career.
Speaker 3:And I also think it's important to kind of just kind of point out that different cities have different plans. Obviously, some do seven, eight, even lower than that. Prime example, like a small little town that I worked in East Texas was a 25-year city. Marshall was a 20-year city and I wasn't able to capitalize on the years of service at retirement age. However, those funds are still in my TMRS account and so it kind of I don't want to say it kind of messed me up or hurt my TMRS impact. It would have been better had Jefferson been 20. But for the viewer watcher out there, that comes at Terrell Police Department and they transfer down to Crandall. Let's say Terrell is a 25-year city, crandall is a 20. Talk about the benefits of staying with Crandall, or how many years of benefits. Is there a difference there? As far as what, if Terrell eventually went to a 20-year city, would they be able to capitalize on the same plan?
Speaker 1:They would. So that's a great example. You always have to meet the higher of the two right. So if you have any time from your 25-year city that you need to meet retirement eligibility, you have to meet the 25-year rule. We have 10 to 12 cities, I think last count that are 25-year cities. So if that 25-year city drops down to 20, that means every employee past future is under the 20-year rule. So you're not locked in at the 25. You now would if you had 23 years and that city did drop down to 20, you're now eligible. Now the benefit of staying in that extra five years is incredible. If you look at your annual statement, we would actually say, hey, if you retire in December of the year, you're eligible. Here's what your options are. If you go five more years, it almost doubles. And that's those interest earnings because, remember, the city matches your interest earnings as well. So it's those interest earnings and it's why we see that effect on members benefits all the time. We're running estimates day in and day out and we're like we see just how much it grows exponentially faster. So if you're 20, you're employing, you have to stay to that 25. If you saw the impact on your benefit, be crazy.
Speaker 1:But that gentleman I was talking to the other day when I was sitting here, telling him just stay, get that vested status, get this pension, he looked at me and just went and walked off and I went oh, oh, dear sir, that's what I said in my head. I was like oh, but but you're not understanding me. I need you to understand what you have just by way of your membership with TMRS. And his other fellow employees that were sitting next to me just apologized to me. I was like, did I offend him in any way by trying to spit facts here, like trying to get him to understand the benefit that he has, just by getting that vested status and getting that retirement eligibility?
Speaker 1:Now we talked about um Maren referenced earlier that she comes from ERS 16 years and then she came to TMRS almost four years ago, right? So we're on the cusp of her four year anniversary. So let's talk about that eligibility, because we know we have troopers, right, we have listening to the in TMP, we have county, we have troopers. So, maren, spit some facts about proportionate retirement, yeah absolutely.
Speaker 2:When you were telling that story I was thinking, oh, but you don't have to stay in municipal government necessarily to hit that five-year vesting TMRS. We do participate in something called the Proportionate Retirement Program, if anyone out there has heard of that. We work cooperatively with the Employees Retirement System, so that's ERS for the folks who work for state agencies. We work with TCDRS, texas County and District Retirement System, trs, which is the Teachers Retirement System, city of Austin Retirement System and the Judicial Retirement System, and we will all recognize each other's time and service credit back and forth for purposes of vesting and for purposes of retirement eligibility. So if Shannon's gentleman had left his city at the four and a half year mark and then moved over you know DPS or county sheriff and became a member of one of those other retirement systems that we work directly with, we would recognize any time they earn over there and let him use it to meet the five-year vest or the 20-year retirement eligibility. And since there's so much movement back and forth in the public sector, especially for your population, it's a really great benefit.
Speaker 2:Like Shannon said, I always use myself as an example. I left ERS with 16 years of time. It's basically walked in the door with TMRS, with them recognizing those 16 years. When I hit my four years with TMRS next month, I will have the 20 years total service credit that I'll need to be eligible for that TMRS benefit and it'll go in the other direction as well ERS. They'll recognize any of the time I'm earning now and let me use it to meet their rule of 80. And when the time comes, when I'm eligible through each system, I'll draw a separate benefit from each, calculated monetarily on the actual money that I have in each system. So the accounts themselves stay separate, money stays separate. We don't transfer anything, we don't combine it. It's just essentially a recognition and an acknowledgement of that service credit and it's such a great benefit.
Speaker 1:So what you're saying is you're going to be eligible to retire from TMRS next month, so if we make her mad, she can walk out the door. Essentially, that's what it comes down to.
Speaker 3:But we're not because we love her and y'all may not know this, but in police work and specifically the cities, we get a letter when you're eligible, yes, and when you walk into those detectives' offices or administrators, we always have them in a plaque and I'm not going to go into detail of the explicitives that we call it, but it's basically your FU letter. So when you get mad you can take that plaque and you can walk out and you're done. Talk about, real quick, the Rule of 80.
Speaker 3:I didn't understand it until I transferred over to the county, when I left the city, and it was kind of difficult for me to understand. I'm not going to say that it was just and TMRS seemed better. So when guys get into law enforcement they say, hey, what departments or what agencies are better? And I always tell them you got to look at the retirement aspect because TC is not a shot at TCDRS in whatsoever way. But it seemed to me like the role of AD was a little bit more challenging to understand versus the TMRS aspect of a 20-year mark. Talk about the role of AD and how it impacts them.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, I mean in terms of determining your eligibility, sure, knowing when I hit 20, I'm eligible, that's infinitely more understandable. Rule of 80 is essentially you add together your age in years and months and your service credit in years and months, and once you reach 80, that's when you're eligible to retire. Now, full disclosure. That is not the only way that folks who have the ERS retirement benefit can meet eligibility. They have other ones. I was just using that as an example, but kind of the easiest one to look at is you know, you've got someone who starts working at the age of 20. They do 30 years. Now they are 50 years of age. They have 30 years of service credit. 50 plus 30, that equals 80.
Speaker 3:Yeah, Okay, I just wanted to point that out because it was like man I got to be here versus the city it was 20. You could punch out and go somewhere else.
Speaker 1:So that's a good point. Punch out and go somewhere else. Return to work. Beneficiary. Oh my God, we have so many things that we could talk about lapse of service.
Speaker 3:After they retire they can come back and be the rehire, retire, rehire program kind of loops into that house bill. This I was reading it online. It could be not factual, but uh yeah, talk about the rehire aspect of it, of the retirement the return to work.
Speaker 1:Oh, that's actually a couple years old now.
Speaker 2:I'm trying to get off that there was a bill in the last session, but I don't think that one ended up passing okay, teamers does have return to work, which this is.
Speaker 1:We talk about retirement and you hear so many people are, oh, we can't retire. But in teamers world we, when we say retire, we say you've just met the eligibility criteria, that if you wanted to terminate from your job, punch out, like you said, and start collecting your benefit, Okay, you can. We're not saying go sit on the porch in the rocking chair and yell at the kids running across the lawn. That's not what we're saying. We're just saying you've met the eligibility. If you want to draw, draw, go do something else, go have another career. Right, you can retire from TMRS and go have another career. Now, in the past you could not return to your own city. So if you retired from if Clint, if he retired from Garland, if he wanted to go back to Garland, he could not have in the past.
Speaker 3:Now he just has to have a one-year separation.
Speaker 1:He can return back to Garland, still receive that retirement, collect his retirement, start a new TMRS membership and start building another retirement account. Now if he wants to go to any other city, versus TMPA, he can go to any other city as long as he goes after the calendar month of his retirement or after. So if you retire in July, you can't go until August, but you can literally build up multiple memberships and have multiple pension checks coming to you. So I think that's another misconception and people think oh, when you retire it's almost like Social Security you can't go to work, I can't earn so much money. No, go earn as much money as you want. Understand the implications of returning to the same city or to another TMRS city. Understand that and you're okay, because you don't want to cross that line of oh, I terminated in employment July 15th and I've been offered this other position and I'm going to retire July 15th. No, no, no, you're retiring the last day of the month. I know we get really passionate about understanding retirement dates are the last day of the month.
Speaker 2:And, if I can jump in, I've got a situation I ran across not too long ago just like that, had an individual. They were with City A and they separated employment. Their last day going into the office was in the month of February and they decided to stay on the payroll with that city into the month of March for insurance purposes and they applied for their TMRS retirement benefit and their TMRS retirement date was March the 31st. They took a position in a TMRS eligible position with another city and they started that new job in the month of March.
Speaker 2:Before that pending March 31st retirement date, in their mind, they thought everything was good because they hadn't been at work at the other city since February. They thought all I have to do is, you know, leave one, go to the other, not thinking about the importance of the retirement date. So, tmrs, our plan does not allow for what are called in-service distributions of the funds. So he had this pending March 31st retirement date. We got enrollment information from City B in the month of March putting him into their plan and it canceled his pending retirement because he wasn't eligible anymore, because he was back as an active participant and it was just one of those things where there's not anything we can do to fix that once it has happened. So making sure.
Speaker 3:Really so he had to.
Speaker 2:he was just kind of I mean he could have then left the job with City B and retired the account at that point.
Speaker 3:sure that when people are making those decisions about retiring, about coming back to work, especially when it's in a TMRS city, in a TMRS eligible position, that they understand the timing and the impact of those decisions, that they're making and I'll speak on this just from my experience on the professional level with TMPA, but also whenever I was leaving Marshall and other cities is that if you guys have any questions, you ladies and gentlemen out there that are in public service work, that are TMRS recipients or contributors TMRS truly is there to help you out. They're going to answer questions, email you back. They've always kind of been there on the fly. Whenever I have just a, I'll be driving down the road and just have a question about it, I'll call the 1-800 number and, boom, I get answered.
Speaker 3:There's been some revisions on the, I think, the website. There's some updates on what you wanted to kind of cover and it's interesting to get on there and just kind of play around of hey, I can punch out on this age and I can receive this. This is kind of a two-part question. Talk about the updates with the website. Two, what if I did retire at the age of 50? Is it y'all's and this could be personal or professional is it your personal or professional opinion that that retired individual wait five years in order to allow those funds to gain interest, or is it better to go ahead and start receiving those pension funds then? I guess it depends on the individual probably.
Speaker 2:It's case by case I think, yeah, it really does depend on the individual person and the financial situation that they're in. Because, to your point, if they left their job at the age of 50 and decided not to retire until the age of 55, right, their account balance it's still growing, they're still getting that 5% interest, and then five years down the road they're five years older, right, so that retirement benefit will be larger. But then, on the flip side, they will have missed out on the five years worth of payments from age 50 to 55. So, kind of doing those calculations and the return on the investment of waiting versus collecting, now, it really is a person-to-person decision, I think.
Speaker 1:But I think that the redesign in my Team Rest allows for so much information to be out there so that each person can make an informed decision. And the redesign if you haven't already gone to my Team Rest or registered your account, go go, because back in May we launched an entirely new redesign where now you see every penny that's in your account, your money, your interest, which you've always seen but you now see the city's matching funds. You see the city, not just the matching funds, but if there's updated, you see city contributions. And now you can go in and you can customize your estimate. You can say, hey, you know how we talked about. This is my favorite part of the redesign is that you can actually stop your contributions. So if I decided, hey, guess what, I've been offered a job over here, thinking about going over there and because I'm vested, I'm going to leave my city in December, I can go in there and say, okay, this is my last contribution, date, december, but I'm not going to retire it for 10 more years. What's going to be the impact on my benefit and what's my benefit going to be in 10 years? You can now run all of those estimates, which I think really hits home with individuals who have those misconceptions that I don't get the city's money unless I do five.
Speaker 1:I was at a city last week and you know, you see those when you're doing presentations and you're talking to people and you see the light bulbs literally going off in their head. And I was. I was doing this presentation and it's just kind of an overview of TMRS and I was hitting on the topic that you don't have to be here for five years to get that city's money. And I saw in the back of the room a table of guys light bulbs are going off and as I was walking out they followed. They didn't stay for the next presenter, they followed me and one of them walked out and had on his phone, in his hand his phone, had his my Teamworks account and he goes.
Speaker 1:So what I heard you say is that I was, I came from, he came from the city of Prosper, he goes. I spent four years in Prosper. Now I'm over here. You're telling me I'm going to be vested in one year and I said yes, and he goes and I get their money. And I said do you have my team risk pulled up on your phone? He said yeah. I said let's look at the numbers. Sure enough, his date of vesting was July of 26. I go that's one year that you've been at the city, right? He said yeah, I said that's your vesting day because you have this four years for Prosper. He said yeah, and I said do you see your city's match right there? You didn't lose them just because you left after four years.
Speaker 1:And to me that was the aha moment. Then he goes and I'm like it's right here on your account. Why would we have it any other way if it's not true? And he was like oh my gosh. And so I'm really hoping that redesign I already know it's having so many positive effects of people starting to truly understand the benefit of having teamwork because now they can see all of that money, they can customize those estimates, they can say, hey, I'm eligible to retire. But maybe I've been approached by someone who says, hey, shannon, we want you to come work for us. Okay, well, you know what? I don't have to retire my Team Rest account, I can let it sit there and grow. And to that what Maren was saying you let it grow and you can run these numbers. But what's the other best part about my Team Rest? What do we do? You and I both get on our soapbox.
Speaker 3:Oh, beneficiaries, we do, what do? What do you and I both get on our soapbox? Oh, beneficiaries, beneficiaries, yeah, oh my gosh, yeah, talk about that, because we just had this on off off air conversation about a sad situation recently and the spouse of the individual didn't realize.
Speaker 1:talk about those and hit on her and I both have story after story of individuals who passed away, and years ago in teamers I actually worked in the office that processed deaths and I hate to say it that way as a beneficiary team, right In TMRS, not only do you have a benefit for yourself, but once you've hit that vested status, you've locked in a benefit for your beneficiary in the event of your death pre-retirement. So you, we've got to keep these two straight. You've got retirement. The option you choose at retirement dictates what happens upon your death. We have this pre-retirement when you're in TMRS and you have this benefit that you've been building. When you hit that vested status, you've earned a death benefit for your beneficiary in the event you die.
Speaker 1:So the situation that I'm referring to is that there was an officer who died in a city and the city called me that day and she's like I just need to know because their police union rep is calling the HR and they want to know what their benefits are with TMRS.
Speaker 1:And I know the city and I'm talking and I met that gentleman at my retirement meeting earlier, like two months earlier, and she said he finally had said he was going to retire in December and he didn't make it and he passed and she's like we need to know what his wife's benefits are. And they were all convinced that she was losing the city's money because he didn't retire. And we're like, oh no, no, no, no. When you have a vested benefit now your beneficiary gets to come in and retire the account, regardless if he was eligible or not, just by having that vested status. So if you have one beneficiary like this gentleman has his spouse as the only beneficiary she can choose to receive a lifetime payment that includes all of her money and all of the cities, everything. Nothing gets reduced just because that payment's going to a beneficiary.
Speaker 3:And you're referencing a lifetime payment. Is that a one-time payment or is it just a payments over her whole?
Speaker 1:life Once a month for the rest of her life. She is now getting his retirement benefit. That's awesome.
Speaker 2:And if I could just jump in too, because I hear that a lot too they think they'll lose out on the city match and the best way to think about it. The purpose of the city's matching dollars is to fund a monthly retirement payment to someone, whether that someone is the TMRS member, the TMRS retiree, or whether it is their beneficiary. And, like Shannon said, once someone becomes vested, they've locked in that death benefit and the beneficiary actually has options available to them with respect to how they want to collect it. One option would just be a lump sum payment, a refund of the account balance, which would just be the individual's contributions and the interest. But the other option would essentially be for the beneficiary to say this individual was vested. They never had the opportunity to retire the TMRS account themselves. So I'm going to do it as their beneficiary and I'm going to start receiving a monthly payment from TMRS and, like Shannon said, that monthly payment to the beneficiary is funded not only by all of the contributions that individual made, but also the city's matching dollars as well.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:Well, here's the other misconception Cause I spoke with the gentleman this past weekend and he came up and we're looking at his account and I see he had his wife and a child as a beneficiary. And I go, and it was a legit he, he had spousal consent, so it was okay. So let's just say, tyler, do you mind if I put your? You're married, you have two children. I've met them. They're lovely. I love them.
Speaker 3:Your wife is amazing she is so fun Most days Just out in the morning before coffee.
Speaker 1:Tell her. I said hi.
Speaker 3:I will.
Speaker 1:If you had her listed as your only beneficiary and then you put your kids as your alternates. If something happened to you, now your wife can retire the account right Right, get a lifetime payment. If something happened to you and your wife at the same time, your kids become the beneficiaries and now they can get a 15-year payment because there's two of them. Now this gentleman had his wife and his child under the pre-notion that, well, what if something happened to me and my wife? I wanted my daughter to get it and I go, but what if something didn't happen to you and your wife at the same time? You locked your wife and daughter into having to share a 15-year payment Because in death benefits and paying these payments out, if there's one beneficiary, they get a lifetime payment, but if there's multiple beneficiaries primary beneficiaries we can only pay a 15-year payment. There's no life expectancy.
Speaker 1:We can't share multiple life expectancies. So when I told him, I said you've locked your spouse out of being able to receive a lifetime payment in the event you drop dead next week.
Speaker 2:And the two of them would have to agree on the form of payment. One of them couldn't say I want a lump sum and the others say I want the 15-year payment. They have to be in agreement with how that benefit's paid out.
Speaker 3:How would that work if they didn't agree?
Speaker 1:TMRS holds it. I held an account for one year. I held a file Because two kids couldn't agree A brother and a sister could not agree on what to do with mom's money. Agree, a brother and a sister could not agree on what to do with mom's money, and so, until they agree, our law requires agreement between the beneficiaries. So what I like to say and tell everyone if you have that one person in your life that you want to protect for life, you, they have to be the only beneficiaries. However, we know that the worst case scenario can happen. You designate the alternate. So Maren, put your business out there. She's married. She's married. She doesn't have kids. So Aaron's probably her husband is probably her beneficiary.
Speaker 1:I'm not married, but I do have kids. We're we're polar opposites, right? My three kids are the beneficiaries on my account. I'll put that out any day of the week. I'm going to protect them. They're they're my, they're my heartbeat, right? So I know if I die while I'm still working for TMRS, they get the option to take a 15 year payment divided equally between all three of them.
Speaker 1:Now all three of my kids are grown, they're all adults. They're 18 and over. Um, so there's no good. But even if you wanted to put your kids we hear it all the time oh I can't put my kids because they're minors yes, you can, it is your money. Now, if you are going to put a minor, like if you went in and put your wife as your primary and your kids as your alternates, you have the opportunity to designate a custodian, and that custodian is just someone you trust that if the money ever became payable to that child, then they are the ones signing the documents, making the decisions for the child and talk about why it's important not because I ran into this a couple times, sadly.
Speaker 3:We're here at TMPA not to put a grandparent Because majority of the times when they get to that age they're older and you just don't know what life's going to bring. I would do a close, responsible, respected friend that you know is not going to be going anywhere, a sibling of yours. But what's sad is during those times of somebody's darkest hour we see it at TMPA and I see it in my personal life is that's when the family feuds start. You want to?
Speaker 3:see a fight with the family. Oh my gosh, let a death happen. Yeah, death brings out the to see a family. Let a death happen, you know. And so, yeah, 100%, and it's so sad but it's true and and uh, yeah, talk, talk about what, what custodian options someone should have.
Speaker 1:Just like what you said someone you trust, but it is something that you have to think about. Well, what if I'm putting this down? And let's say I put my mom down to be the custodian of my minor children? Well, right here and now, that's probably fine, but in 10 years, if I've never changed that and I have minors, I, if I don't go in and literally look at who I've put down, in 10 years my mom can be someone totally different. And you know, maren mentioned off camera earlier off that how people should just go in on a regular basis and look at their beneficiaries and that my tmrs it allows you to go in and look at it and people go. How many times I'm going to change my beneficiaries? How many?
Speaker 3:times every day. Every day. I had a. I had a co-worker that had his mother-in-law. Now, listen, there's there's very few far between where a man actually enjoys being around his mother-in-law. But this dude had had his mother-in-law as the custodial and I was like man, what the hell are you doing? And so we had a conversation about it. He changed it later on as his brother, but it's just kind of it was funny it was.
Speaker 1:I know that I was doing something that had nothing to do with TMRS a while back and it had to do with legal stuff. And you know, in case something happens to me, I'm on the road all the time. I have to admit that my odds are higher. Right, um, and I was putting my daughter down to be the trustee of something and my little sister looked at me, and when I say little sister, she's like she's 50.
Speaker 2:So she's, she's grown Right.
Speaker 1:And she looks at me and she goes don't you dare put your daughter down. And I looked, I said, but, and she goes don't you dare put your daughter down. And I said, but she's, I'm not married, I'm my kids. And she said do you understand the impact of if something happens to you? What? How distraught your kids are going to be? And this is a legal situation. Put me down. I go aren't you going to be sad if I die? And she goes oh yeah, I'll be horrified, but my husband will be. He's the one that steps up and then he'll.
Speaker 2:he'll grieve after the fact but he'll step up and take care of business.
Speaker 1:So you have to have that person that you know is going to be able to step up and take care of business. Um, we talk about beneficiary designations. I thought about this story the other day because every now and then you kind of wonder am I doing what I'm supposed to be doing? Um, and I remember this story and it hit home with me. Many, many moons ago I was working at a fair in a city and one of the chiefs come over and sit down at my table and it was before the my team was everything, and I said do you want me to look at your account? Because now I know it, Don't worry about it. He was like a 30 year employee, he's like I get it. And I said well, I got to check your beneficiaries, Because, again, soapbox when it comes to beneficiaries. And I look and it goes yeah, it's my ex-wife.
Speaker 2:And I go, your ex-wife.
Speaker 1:And. But I'm looking at his account and it still says spouse and you know, and he looks at me and it goes well, yeah, but I want her to get the money. And I go. Oh my God, I thought I was the only one who thought that way, because at that time my ex-husband was my beneficiary. But I knew better and I knew I had to update that relationship and I said, sir, with all due respect, you need to update this.
Speaker 3:Looking into the mirror at the time.
Speaker 1:I need you to update this and you could tell you know, we say this all the time, but does it click with them and do they just go, yeah, yeah, yeah, one day, I'll do it one day, whatever. And he was like, okay, I'll get on that. Right, I know what that is code for, I'll get on that.
Speaker 1:I know what that's code for Pro all that. I know what that's code for Procrastination Exactly, and I'm really good at faces and names and situations and I remember this stuff. So again, this was probably 15 years ago, Fast forward to during the COVID era. We were not on the road and you know what we did I went back to processing desks and I went back to answering the calls. I went back to answering that 800 number you referenced earlier and I would do like a two hour shift during the day. And I got a call one day and it was from a lady and she's like hey, I'm just calling in to check on, um, my benefits. My ex-husband passed away and she just started talking and I was like I know this story, I know this. And she told me the city which was my town, that I covered my territory and I'm Googling over here on the other side and I Google his picture. He's the chief, he was in the papers, right, and I found him and I was like oh my God, he didn't do it.
Speaker 1:He did it, it was his ex-wife. And he goes and she's telling me. She says I know it's weird that I'm his ex-wife, but he put me down as a beneficiary. And she says and you know what? One day he called me on his way home from work and said hey, I talked to a TMRS lady today.
Speaker 1:And she said you were right, I needed to update that beneficiary and I was. I was frozen, sitting there taking this call and I go. Ma'am, can I tell you something? I don't know if you need to hear this, but I was that TMRS lady and she goes, excuse me, and I go. I'm a member of the education team that we do outreach. We go to cities, we talk, your, your ex-husband's town was my city. I spoke with him. I just Googled his picture. I know him, I'm the, I'm the lady who told him to update it to you, and she, she kind of paused for a minute and she goes. You have no idea how much I needed to hear that right now. I needed to have some kind of connection. And then you know, and then we ended up talking for another 45 minutes because, well, I talk a lot and I don't, I don't, I don't.
Speaker 3:Did she miss out on the retirement? It's going to be the cop's question, because she got the full deal.
Speaker 1:She did because he updated it. He listened to what I said and so I think I needed to hear it from her that he literally went in. When I told him you need to do this, he did it.
Speaker 3:Good.
Speaker 1:And because he did it how he wanted it to play out in the event of his death, played out exactly the way he wanted it to.
Speaker 2:Because there was there was no question of whether or not he still wanted her to be the beneficiary once they had gotten a divorce.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and so it came full circle that something I had said resonated. He did it and the worst case scenario happened he did pass and what he wanted happened, good, good.
Speaker 3:That's the way it should be right that is, but we.
Speaker 1:For every one of those stories I've got 20 that didn't work out because they did not go and update their beneficiary that's what I was going to say is the last time you and debbie were on.
Speaker 3:One of the most impactful things I think me and clint walked away from, and we've got a lot of feedback from some of our viewers and listeners and they said the stories that you guys told, for example, the 680 000 hours, uh, was so impactful. We I think we've heard from shannon's aspect, marion what is your probably most impactful story, whether it be tmrs or east?
Speaker 2:ers.
Speaker 3:Oh my gosh that you can think of, that. You're just walking away going man. We really could have helped that person and they just refused to listen. Because I'll be the first one to tell you law enforcement, we're stubborn. I mean, we are we. We have to have it right in front of our face and make us do things that you guys tell us. What's the? What's been the most impactful story that you can think of?
Speaker 2:Put me on the spot, why don't you know? So I do have one and it's not. It's not a happy ending story necessarily like the one that Shannon had, but since we are talking about beneficiaries, I ran across a situation not too long ago. One of my cities reached out to me and said hey, we've got this employee, long-term employee. He's gone into hospice, doesn't look like he's going to be coming out, he's not fully conscious, he's not cognizant, he's not really aware of what's going on. He's eligible to retire.
Speaker 2:What do we do? And since he wasn't cognizant, wasn't aware, wasn't really in a position to complete a retirement application, did not have a power of attorney on file and wasn't in a position to get one on file, had a beneficiary but had never updated it when he became vested. So what likely will happen? Because this was just very recently, he will likely pass as an active employee prior to retirement without a valid beneficiary on file. Now, that does not mean that TMRS will not pay out the death benefits, but, like Shannon said, we may end up in a situation where those death benefits aren't necessarily being paid out in the manner or to the individuals that he would want them to be. And also, you know we've got a family who's grieving. Now they've got this added.
Speaker 3:The expectations. It's not going to be there.
Speaker 2:Well, and they've got this added stress, this added legwork, this added paperwork, this potential added financial cost to get things squared away so that someone can receive those benefits which both of us like our soapbox hill to die on is that beneficiary designation? Even if you think you have a valid beneficiary designation, check it right, because you might be thinking about the beneficiary you have for your life insurance, or you might be thinking about the beneficiary you have for your 457, or you might be thinking I designated a beneficiary when I was first hired. I still want that same person to be my beneficiary. There's nothing I need to do. But again, you have to do the update when you become vested because, like Shannon mentioned, once you become vested you lock in that death benefit for your beneficiary.
Speaker 3:Does TMRS have a system, because y'all just updated your system not too long ago and for those that don't know and I'm sure you guys know this that if you are an active TMPR member we do offer wills at no cost. Is there a way that you can forward that will information over to TMRS and you guys retain that, or is that something that maybe in later on maybe it could be in the works?
Speaker 1:No, and here's the reason. Your retirement accounts do not pass through your will unless you've designated your estate to be the beneficiary, or it becomes that final default.
Speaker 3:Got you Okay.
Speaker 1:So there is a hierarchy. State law requires TMRs pay the benefit out to the beneficiary on file right, okay.
Speaker 1:Pass away. I pass away. They go. Look at my account, they go oh, shannon had three beneficiaries, let's pay it out to them. But what if I had never updated my beneficiary and my ex-husband was still my beneficiary as spouse? Then that's not a valid designation because our relationship has legally changed. So now it doesn't just become an estate issue, it becomes. Oh, the state law says there's a hierarchy of who gets your money and the first one is any spouse any spouse. So if I was not divorced but it was pending, or if I had just gotten married three weeks earlier and I really wanted my kids for my first marriage to get the money, if there's a legal spouse on file, they get it all 100%, no question. Wow, on file, no any spouse period legal spouse.
Speaker 1:So second, if there's no spouse, let's say I was divorced, I did not have a spouse. Now the second criteria, or the hierarchy, are any surviving children. Okay, that's cool, I have three kids, they would get it. They go through, like Maren said, a lot more red tape to get it, because now there's paperwork, there's heirship affidavits and they're grieving because they just lost mom, right, so that's, you don't really want to go there and y'all kids have come out of the woodwork.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Right. I worked a case one time where nine kids, it all, defaulted to the kids and all of a sudden, all these kids oh, I'm kid, he's my dad, he's my dad, he's my dad and all nine of them did not know who their father was, Didn't know that the others existed.
Speaker 3:Busy man.
Speaker 1:So that was fun, Let me. But you learn from those things, right? You learn so hierarchy spouse, surviving children, last designated beneficiary on file with TMRS, if it's valid. So, and the only thing that invalidates a beneficiary designation is a legal relationship status change or death. So if at one point I had my mom, if my mom was still alive, she'd get it. The fourth default is your estate. So, circling back to the wills, your retirement accounts don't pass through your will without you actually designating the estate to be the beneficiary Got you, okay, and all that is only in place if you do not have a beneficiary listed.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 1:That's why it's so important to have that beneficiary, not to have to put your loved ones through all of that red tape. And I'll also hop on the other soapbox again, that when you're designating your beneficiary it'll say, hey, do you want to designate an alternate? And most people are like no, don't do, it's optional. But in my 23 years it shouldn't be optional. Everyone should have an alternate, because you never know worse. I you in your line of work have seen worst case scenario. I've seen it on paper, right. I've seen the murder, suicides. I've seen the family all wiped out in a car accident and every person. I've seen the worst case scenario on paper and how, how it played out. So alternate beneficiaries are you never know.
Speaker 3:So there have been cases where people have contributed to MRS and that that payment would never. What happens with that? I mean nobody in their family gets it at that point, or is it just a long legal process?
Speaker 1:It's a long legal process, it's still, at the end of the day, state law dictates to TMRS that we have to pay that money out.
Speaker 3:Okay.
Speaker 1:So TMRS is never going to keep the money, we're never going to return it to the city and we do not return, we don't hand it over to the state of Texas. We go on a concerted effort every year to reach out to every account.
Speaker 3:This still has payables.
Speaker 2:We do.
Speaker 1:I think that's why we're so passionate about beneficiaries and that this MyTMRS redesign allows people to go in and just easily designate that beneficiary. Cover your bases.
Speaker 2:Just to circle back to your original question about people submitting their, their wills to us just to have on file, it's not necessary. Even if someone has specifically designated their estate as the beneficiary, no need to submit it in advance. If and when the time comes, we will reach out to request the necessary documents.
Speaker 3:Got you Makes sense, makes sense. Well, reach out to request the necessary documents. Got you Makes sense, makes sense? Well, hey, I think we covered everything, but I wanted to double check and make sure we covered the new 8% rule with that house bill coming out. We covered some other things that we didn't cover last episode and some changes within TMRS. That seem positive, you guys are pretty pumped.
Speaker 2:And one thing we did not mention when we were talking about the MyTMRS redesign, because Shannon mentioned the visibility into the city contributions, the ability to customize estimates. You can also now actually submit your retirement application through your MyTMRS account as well.
Speaker 3:That's cool.
Speaker 2:That just went live 1st of July, so brand, brand new.
Speaker 3:It seems like you guys are always kind of coming up for different ways to make it easier for somebody to punch out, right. To punch out, get the hell out of Dodge and go. But yeah, so again, if you guys have any questions, tmrs has always been available for questions, ideas. If you're driving down the road you're like man, what ifs? That's what TMRS is there for. That's why I've always been an advocate for them to reach out and give you guys a call. Thank you Last words of advice from you guys.
Speaker 1:Ooh advice, advice, Get the information. No, don't assume.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Absolutely get the information. No, don't assume. Yeah, absolutely. And to piggyback off what you're saying if you have questions, if you're not sure how your TMRS account works or when you're going to be eligible, or what will happen if you leave or what will happen if you stay, please reach out to us. That's what we're here for. We want to be sure that everyone has the information they need to make those informed decisions, because those decisions have such a huge impact on our members' finances and their family and their future.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and if you don't know who your rep is or if your city's wanting to have some kind of presentation done, reach out to CMRS and they can hook you up.
Speaker 1:We can now. With that being said, you threw that one out there. There is only four of us for the whole state for the whole state. So I cover the north dallas east like uh east of frisco um they live in, live in austin yeah, we all live in austin, so I cover the, the north of um or east of frisco, north up to texas, canada down to beaumont area, and whereas Marin covers the.
Speaker 2:I cover the Fort Worth side of the Metroplex, up through Wichita Falls, up through Lubbock, all the way up to the Amarillo area, oh wow.
Speaker 1:Right. And then we have Ida Gomez, who covers the Houston area, and then Lorraine Moreno, who covers the South Texas area, so the four of us are literally on the road all the time. Yeah.
Speaker 3:On, are literally on the road all the time. Yeah, on the education side, on the education.
Speaker 1:Yeah, our entire, our entire job is education of the benefits. Um, we, you know we're, we're schooled and all the other things that happen. But I think our passion is our members, our members, you, every officer, every, every employee with the city. Um, is they're employee with the city? Is they're? They're public servants and they deserve this benefit. So my goal is to make sure that they they understand their benefit, under understand it, make an informed decision.
Speaker 3:Yeah, there you go Straight from the source. You guys visit TMRS. They've got a new website, some updates on their stuff that they're the student program they just rolled. They just rolled out Super excited to have you back on. Maybe we can come back on in about a year or so, give some updates on what our members should take a look at.
Speaker 1:I might be retired, you might be retired, I'll still be here.
Speaker 3:Well, erin might be. She's eligible, also coming from ERS. Hey, you guys, take care, stay safe, god bless you and, as always, may God bless Texas.
Speaker 1:We're out, perfect. Yay, I was sitting there going.
Speaker 3:I didn't know what the hell's up with that echo.
